9.18 BIND not iterated over all authoritative nameservers

[Michael Martinell]

Thanks to all who responded. Putting qname-minimization disabled; in named.conf resolves the issue in my testing.

I did try specifying relaxed (which appears to be the default), but that didn’t work either.
I agree it would be great if the far ends would make sure what they publish is correct, but it will take a large company to push them to do so.



Michael Martinell
Network/Broadband Technician
Interstate Telecommunications Coop., Inc.
From: bind-users <bind-users-bounces at lists.isc.org> On Behalf Of Paul Stead
Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2023 11:35 AM
Cc: bind-users at lists.isc.org
Subject: Re: 9.18 BIND not iterated over all authoritative nameservers

I wasn't

On Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 5:23 PM Ondřej Surý <ondrej at isc.org<mailto:ondrej at isc.org>> wrote:
Please don’t use Postel’s Law as excuse for implementations that break standards: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc9413<https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc9413>
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Ondřej Surý — ISC (He/Him)

My working hours and your working hours may be different. Please do not feel obligated to reply outside your normal working hours.


On 28. 10. 2023, at 17:50, Paul Stead <paul.stead at gmail.com<mailto:paul.stead at gmail.com>> wrote:

As a previous ISP admin I too have come across similar situations and frustrations.

I can only say that Google and Cloudflare seem to follow Postel's Law moreso than BIND.

I agree this perpetuates bad practices but end users aren't interested in technical reasoning, especially when "it works everywhere else, you must be broken"

Paul

On Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 3:56 PM Rick Frey <gribnut at gmail.com<mailto:gribnut at gmail.com>> wrote:
As Mark mentions, the NS records gtm.bankeasy.com<http://gtm.bankeasy.com> need to be corrected and failure is not due to lack of iterating through all auth nameservers (all of the auth nameservers have the bad NS record anyway).

Not sure how many other domains you are running into similar problem, but you could disable qname-minimization in 9.18 to mimic previous behavior of 9.16 if that number is large.  I believe qname-minimization is a global directive so it would remove privacy benefits of QNAME minimization for all recursive queries from your nameserver.

As DNS admin of another ISP, I sympathize dealing with failures caused by non-compliant authoritative nameservers.  These non-compliant auth nameservers can have little motivation to fix, especially when other large ISPs or public resolvers (looking at you Google and Cloudflare) don’t enforce DNS standards.   Many non-compliant nameservers/records would be cleaned up if public/centralized DNS providers such as Google/Cloudflare would enforce since it would inflict those failures on a much larger user base.

 - Rick




On Oct 27, 2023, at 6:31 PM, Mark Andrews <marka at isc.org<mailto:marka at isc.org>> wrote:



Named now uses NS lookups to perform QNAME minimisation.  If one puts garbage in the NS
records then they should expect lookups to fail.  The NS records on both sides of a zone
cut are supposed to be IDENTICAL.  This is not a new requirement.  It has been this way
since the very beginning.

The bank needs to fix what they publish.

Mark


On 28 Oct 2023, at 02:36, Michael Martinell via bind-users <bind-users at lists.isc.org<mailto:bind-users at lists.isc.org>> wrote:

Hello,
At this point I am hoping that somebody might have a workaround so that we can exclude domains from this behavior if they are broken on the far end. Does anybody have a workaround for this?
We are a small ISP and run BIND compiled from source. We currently run 9.16.x
Every time we try to move forward with 9.18 customers start to complain that they are unable to reach certain websites.  This includes banks, universities, and other organizations.
I understand the goal is to get all DNS to RFC 6891, but from a practical standpoint, this isn’t working for customers, so we are prevented from upgrading either.
Related website:
https://gitlab.isc.org/isc-projects/bind9/-/issues/3152<https://gitlab.isc.org/isc-projects/bind9/-/issues/3152>
Our source code compile options:
./configure --with-gnu-ld --with-libxml2 --with-json-c --with-openssl=/usr/local/openssl && make && make install && ldconfig



Interstate Telecommunications Coop., Inc.
312 4th Street West • Clear Lake, SD 57226
Phone: (605) 874-8313
michael.martinell at itccoop.com<mailto:michael.martinell at itccoop.com>
www.itc-web.com<http://www.itc-web.com>


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